Grammar police

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Grammar police

Don V Nielsen
" An application interact with the database engine using function calls,
not be sending messages to a separate process or thread."

"An applications [interacts] ..., [not by]...
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Re: Grammar police

Don V Nielsen
Sorry. This was in the Quirks, Caveats page, #2.

On Thu, Jul 11, 2019 at 9:57 AM Don V Nielsen <[hidden email]> wrote:

> " An application interact with the database engine using function calls,
> not be sending messages to a separate process or thread."
>
> "An applications [interacts] ..., [not by]...
>
>
>
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Re: Grammar police

David Raymond
Other small ones from the Quirks page:

Section 2:
"to realize the SQLite is not intended as"
 to realize [that] SQLite is not intended as

Section 3.2:
"SQLite as no DATETIME datatype."
 SQLite [has] no DATETIME datatype

Section 5:
"Due to an historical oversight"
 Due to [a] historical oversight

Section 6:
"each output row might be composed from two more more rows"
 each output row might be composed from two [or] more rows

"then the one of the rows is chosen arbitrarily"
 then one of the rows is chosen arbitrarily

Section 8:
   "into bad habit of"
    into [the] bad habit of
or  into bad habit[s] of


(I always feel a little weird when pointing out typos as the meaning is usually perfectly fine the way it is, it feels like I'm being overly critical, and I worry my "corrections" are also not quite right)


-----Original Message-----
From: sqlite-users <[hidden email]> On Behalf Of Don V Nielsen
Sent: Thursday, July 11, 2019 10:58 AM
To: General Discussion of SQLite Database <[hidden email]>
Subject: Re: [sqlite] Grammar police

Sorry. This was in the Quirks, Caveats page, #2.

On Thu, Jul 11, 2019 at 9:57 AM Don V Nielsen <[hidden email]> wrote:

> " An application interact with the database engine using function calls,
> not be sending messages to a separate process or thread."
>
> "An applications [interacts] ..., [not by]...
>
>
>
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Re: Grammar police

Richard Hipp-3
On 7/11/19, David Raymond <[hidden email]> wrote:
> Section 5:
> "Due to an historical oversight"
>  Due to [a] historical oversight
>

Here in the Southeastern US (specifically in Charlotte, NC) we really
do say "an historical oversight".  If you said "a historical
oversight", people would look at you funny. Ginger tells me that "a
historical" is technically correct, but I'm going with what people
(here) actually say. :-)

All the other corrections, in this email and in other recent mailing
list posts, should now have been applied.  Thanks, everybody, for
sending them in.  Please feel free to do so at any time.  You can send
them directly to me if you don't want to send them to the mailing
list.
--
D. Richard Hipp
[hidden email]
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Re: Grammar police

Richard Hipp-3
In reply to this post by David Raymond
On 7/11/19, David Raymond <[hidden email]> wrote:
> Section 5:
> "Due to an historical oversight"
>  Due to [a] historical oversight
>

Here in the Southeastern US (specifically in Charlotte, NC) we really
do say "an historical oversight".  If you said "a historical
oversight", people would look at you funny. Ginger tells me that "a
historical" is technically correct, but I'm going with what people
(here) actually say. :-)

All the other corrections, in this email and in other recent mailing
list posts, should now have been applied.  Thanks, everybody, for
sending them in.  Please feel free to do so at any time.  You can send
them directly to me if you don't want to send them to the mailing
list.
--
D. Richard Hipp
[hidden email]
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Re: Grammar police

Warren Young
In reply to this post by Richard Hipp-3
On Jul 11, 2019, at 10:41 AM, Richard Hipp <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> Here in the Southeastern US (specifically in Charlotte, NC) we really
> do say "an historical oversight".  If you said "a historical
> oversight", people would look at you funny.

<html lang="en-US-Southern">…  :)

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Re: Grammar police

Carl Edquist
In reply to this post by Richard Hipp-3
> Ginger tells me that "a historical" is technically correct,

AFAICT, "an historical" is correct iff the "h" in "historical" is silent.

Eg, "It's an 'istorical oversight to pronounce the 'h' in 'historical'."


On Thu, 11 Jul 2019, Richard Hipp wrote:

> On 7/11/19, David Raymond <[hidden email]> wrote:
>> Section 5:
>> "Due to an historical oversight"
>>  Due to [a] historical oversight
>>
>
> Here in the Southeastern US (specifically in Charlotte, NC) we really
> do say "an historical oversight".  If you said "a historical
> oversight", people would look at you funny. Ginger tells me that "a
> historical" is technically correct, but I'm going with what people
> (here) actually say. :-)
>
> All the other corrections, in this email and in other recent mailing
> list posts, should now have been applied.  Thanks, everybody, for
> sending them in.  Please feel free to do so at any time.  You can send
> them directly to me if you don't want to send them to the mailing
> list.
> --
> D. Richard Hipp
> [hidden email]
> _______________________________________________
> sqlite-users mailing list
> [hidden email]
> http://mailinglists.sqlite.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/sqlite-users
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Re: Grammar police

Ned Fleming
On 2019-07-11 2:31 PM, Carl Edquist wrote:
>> Ginger tells me that "a historical" is technically correct,
>
> AFAICT, "an historical" is correct iff the "h" in "historical" is silent.
>
> Eg, "It's an 'istorical oversight to pronounce the 'h' in 'historical'."
>

 From the New Oxford American Dictionary entry for "an" --

"usage: Is it ’a historical document’ or ’an historical document’? ‘A
hotel’ or ‘an hotel’? There is still some divergence of opinion over
which form of the indefinite article should be used before words that
begin with h- and have an unstressed first syllable. In the 18th and
19th centuries, people often did not pronounce the initial h for these
words, and so an was commonly used. Today the h is pronounced, and so it
is logical to use a rather than an. However, the indefinite article an
is still encountered before the h in both British and American English,
particularly with historical: in the Oxford English Corpus around a
quarter of examples of historical are preceded with an rather than a."

An is fading in this usage but certainly still acceptable.

--
Ned
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Re: [SPAM?] Re: Grammar police

Richard Damon
On 7/11/19 3:45 PM, Ned Fleming wrote:

> On 2019-07-11 2:31 PM, Carl Edquist wrote:
>>> Ginger tells me that "a historical" is technically correct,
>>
>> AFAICT, "an historical" is correct iff the "h" in "historical" is
>> silent.
>>
>> Eg, "It's an 'istorical oversight to pronounce the 'h' in 'historical'."
>>
>
> From the New Oxford American Dictionary entry for "an" --
>
> "usage: Is it ’a historical document’ or ’an historical document’? ‘A
> hotel’ or ‘an hotel’? There is still some divergence of opinion over
> which form of the indefinite article should be used before words that
> begin with h- and have an unstressed first syllable. In the 18th and
> 19th centuries, people often did not pronounce the initial h for these
> words, and so an was commonly used. Today the h is pronounced, and so
> it is logical to use a rather than an. However, the indefinite article
> an is still encountered before the h in both British and American
> English, particularly with historical: in the Oxford English Corpus
> around a quarter of examples of historical are preceded with an rather
> than a."
>
> An is fading in this usage but certainly still acceptable.
>
Yes, the a / an distinction is largely based on the following sound,
'an' if it is a vowel, 'a' if it is not (the n sound breaks up the
double vowel). words that begin with an initial unstressed h-vowel might
not have the h really vocalized, so the following sound is vowelish, so
it takes 'an' (there isn't enough h to break up the vowel cluster). This
can largely be affected by the accent one talks with (which can be
related but different than the dialect).

--
Richard Damon

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Re: Grammar police

Jose Isaias Cabrera-4
In reply to this post by Warren Young

Warren Young, on Thursday, July 11, 2019 03:13 PM, wrote...
>
> On Jul 11, 2019, at 10:41 AM, Richard Hipp, on
> >
> > Here in the Southeastern US (specifically in Charlotte, NC) we really
> > do say "an historical oversight".  If you said "a historical
> > oversight", people would look at you funny.

"an historical oversight" is the correct English syntax, by the way. ;-)
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Re: Grammar police

Warren Young
On Jul 12, 2019, at 10:16 AM, Jose Isaias Cabrera <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
>>> Here in the Southeastern US (specifically in Charlotte, NC) we really
>>> do say "an historical oversight".  If you said "a historical
>>> oversight", people would look at you funny.
>
> "an historical oversight" is the correct English syntax, by the way. ;-)

I can highly recommend the book “Word by Word: The Secret Life of Dictionaries,” written by one of the editors at Merriam-Webster.  The author spends much of her book illustrating why prescriptivist approaches to language are doomed to failure.

    https://amzn.to/2xJW65R
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Re: Grammar police

Stephen Chrzanowski
In reply to this post by Jose Isaias Cabrera-4
"an historical oversight" feels dirty to me, mostly because it's an
incomplete sentence and can be understood in different ways.  It's a
"point", or answer to a question.

In my verbage, "historical" begins with an H (Note here "AN H", not "A H",
because when saying "H", it starts with a vowel sound).  Its the same as
you wouldn't say "I hear an hissing noise", or "I just learned an History
Lesson".  Words prefixed with the sound "HISS" should be prefixed with "A"
in my mind, unless the H is silent, like Honor or Honest.

However, that said, it'd also probably depend on what the sentence is going
to be describing.  "I went to a historical event" leaves a bad taste in my
mouth, while "I went to an historical event" feels better, because I think
the E in Event carries over to the "AN", or, it could be a past vs present
meaning of the sentence.  But if I say "I've just learned a historical
lesson", the "L" sound in Lesson doesn't carry over correctly to "AN".

Let me be clear I'm not saying you're wrong or right, just that, in my head
and my syntax when I write sentences, anything that begins with H would end
up having an "A" prefix.  I don't use the word Historical or History all
that often, so I can't say how I've written it out in the past.

That said, the point of the sentence is presented whether "AN" or "A" is
used, in my opinion.  This is going down the lines of (Dare I say) is it
ESS-QUE-EL or "SEEK-WIL".

In my case, if I were to read that entire paragraph, I probably wouldn't
even blink on "... an historical oversight ..." or "... a historical
oversight ...".

On Fri, Jul 12, 2019 at 12:16 PM Jose Isaias Cabrera <[hidden email]>
wrote:

>
> Warren Young, on Thursday, July 11, 2019 03:13 PM, wrote...
> >
> > On Jul 11, 2019, at 10:41 AM, Richard Hipp, on
> > >
> > > Here in the Southeastern US (specifically in Charlotte, NC) we really
> > > do say "an historical oversight".  If you said "a historical
> > > oversight", people would look at you funny.
>
> "an historical oversight" is the correct English syntax, by the way. ;-)
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> [hidden email]
> http://mailinglists.sqlite.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/sqlite-users
>
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Re: Grammar police

Carl Edquist
> Note here "AN H", not "A H", because when saying "H", it starts with a
> vowel sound


Re: Aitch vs. Haitch:

https://www.theguardian.com/science/shortcuts/2013/nov/04/letter-h-contentious-alphabet-history-alphabetical-rosen


On Fri, 12 Jul 2019, Stephen Chrzanowski wrote:

> "an historical oversight" feels dirty to me, mostly because it's an
> incomplete sentence and can be understood in different ways.  It's a
> "point", or answer to a question.
>
> In my verbage, "historical" begins with an H (Note here "AN H", not "A H",
> because when saying "H", it starts with a vowel sound).  Its the same as
> you wouldn't say "I hear an hissing noise", or "I just learned an History
> Lesson".  Words prefixed with the sound "HISS" should be prefixed with "A"
> in my mind, unless the H is silent, like Honor or Honest.
>
> However, that said, it'd also probably depend on what the sentence is going
> to be describing.  "I went to a historical event" leaves a bad taste in my
> mouth, while "I went to an historical event" feels better, because I think
> the E in Event carries over to the "AN", or, it could be a past vs present
> meaning of the sentence.  But if I say "I've just learned a historical
> lesson", the "L" sound in Lesson doesn't carry over correctly to "AN".
>
> Let me be clear I'm not saying you're wrong or right, just that, in my head
> and my syntax when I write sentences, anything that begins with H would end
> up having an "A" prefix.  I don't use the word Historical or History all
> that often, so I can't say how I've written it out in the past.
>
> That said, the point of the sentence is presented whether "AN" or "A" is
> used, in my opinion.  This is going down the lines of (Dare I say) is it
> ESS-QUE-EL or "SEEK-WIL".
>
> In my case, if I were to read that entire paragraph, I probably wouldn't
> even blink on "... an historical oversight ..." or "... a historical
> oversight ...".
>
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Re: Grammar police

Simon Slavin-3
Folks, lets return to charter, please.  DRH is writing the document.  He gets to pick the language to be used.  You want something else, write your own.
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Re: Grammar police

Jose Isaias Cabrera-4
In reply to this post by Warren Young

Warren Young, on Friday, July 12, 2019 12:53 PM, wrote...
>
> On Jul 12, 2019, at 10:16 AM, Jose Isaias Cabrera, on

> > "an historical oversight" is the correct English syntax, by the way. ;-)
>
> I can highly recommend the book “Word by Word: The Secret Life of
> Dictionaries,” written by one of the editors at Merriam-Webster.  The
> author spends much of her book illustrating why prescriptivist approaches
> to language are doomed to failure.

I wouldn't read that. Anything that tells me that doing the right thing is going to make me fail in life, is not worth reading. ;-)  Can you imagine if we started sending any command to the SQLite3 tool? For example,

HEY SQL TOOL, GIVE ME THE LIST OF ALL THE LAST NAME THAT START WITH C; NOW!;

That wouldn't get you anywhere. There is an old proverb that goes something like, "Do no remove the ancient landmarks that your fathers have set."  When we start doing we what want, we lose our point of reference. :-)  Sorry. Back to coding...

josé
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Re: Grammar police

Keith Medcalf

>> I can highly recommend the book “Word by Word: The Secret Life of
>> Dictionaries,” written by one of the editors at Merriam-Webster.
>> The author spends much of her book illustrating why prescriptivist
>> approaches to language are doomed to failure.

Merriam-Webster does not publish a Dictionary.  The thing that most 'tards refer to as a "Dictionary" is actually a Lexicon, not a Dictionary.

Now back to our regularly scheduled programming ...

--
The fact that there's a Highway to Hell but only a Stairway to Heaven says a lot about anticipated traffic volume.




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Re: Grammar police

Don V Nielsen
Not to be argumentative with Keith, as I'm have the sinking feeling that
slitting my own throat would be a more pleasurable experience. But, here it
goes:

A *lexicon* is a list of words that belong to a particular language.

Sometimes, *lexicon* is used as another word for *thesaurus* (see below)

A *dictionary* is a list of words and phrases that are (or were) in common
usage, *together with their definitions* - so a dictionary is different
from a lexicon because a lexicon is a simple list and doesn't define the
words.

A *thesaurus* is a dictionary of synonyms (different words and phrases that
have the same or similar meaning).

Finally, for completeness, a *vocabulary* is a list of words that an
individual knows or uses regularly. Vocabulary is different from lexicon
because vocabulary is about what an individual or group of people know,
whereas lexicon is about the language itself.

On Fri, Jul 12, 2019 at 1:52 PM Keith Medcalf <[hidden email]> wrote:

>
> >> I can highly recommend the book “Word by Word: The Secret Life of
> >> Dictionaries,” written by one of the editors at Merriam-Webster.
> >> The author spends much of her book illustrating why prescriptivist
> >> approaches to language are doomed to failure.
>
> Merriam-Webster does not publish a Dictionary.  The thing that most 'tards
> refer to as a "Dictionary" is actually a Lexicon, not a Dictionary.
>
> Now back to our regularly scheduled programming ...
>
> --
> The fact that there's a Highway to Hell but only a Stairway to Heaven says
> a lot about anticipated traffic volume.
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
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> [hidden email]
> http://mailinglists.sqlite.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/sqlite-users
>
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